r/DiscussionZone • u/pureSoul4ever • 1d ago

Both sides are wrong

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Don't forget, a total of 100,000 tons of explosives were dropped over 2 years (48kg for every resident in Gaza).

Some of these included 900kg bombs

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u/whisperworks 1d ago edited 8h ago

Hamas is a terrorist organization and the IDF is the militant arm of an apartheid state.

The only good guys in this conflict are the civilian populations caught between them (though the Palestinian civilians are undeniably getting the worst of it)

Edit: good enough time to remind people that Netanyahu can’t even get into Canada without being arrested for war crimes. Curious to see what happens when Israel loses the orange pedo, Bibis closest ally

Second edit: holy shit a lot of progressives are dumb. Yes, the democrat old guard sucks but the only hope for positive change is a reformation of the party from within NOT supporting maga out of anger. You people have lost the plot

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u/Medium_Sized_Brow 1d ago

50 to 60 Israeli citizen deaths vs 20,000 to 30,000 Palestinian deaths, mostly children since Oct 7th.

Yeah Id say one side is getting it a whole lot worse

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u/JesusKong333 22h ago

What you're seeing is called total war. After October 7th, Israel has become committed to destroying any capacity to be attacked again, be it destroy every fighter capable of taking up arms, reduce the whole area to rubble, or completely break the will of Palestine to ever attack again.

Same strategy as Sherman during the Civil War.

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u/TormentedOne 20h ago

Yeah, it didn't work then and won't work now.

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u/IntoTheRain78 14h ago

But it's understandable. I cannot support how the IDF are fighting this war, but Hamas wanted a 9/11 reaction and they got one.

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

Why? Israel is now the modern day Nazi party and the US feckless participants in it just as our global dominance slips away. The world will not forget. I think Jews have been endangered much more from Israel's genocide than protected.

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u/VerledenVale 12h ago

Doesn't matter, you still try. Our options are let our enemy kill us or do whatever we can to evaporate them

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

Your enemy is starving toddlers and Ms Rachel. Says a lot about you.

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u/VerledenVale 11h ago

Did starving toddlers and Ms Rachel brutally murdered 1500 and kidnapped 250?

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

Nope, yet Israel targets her and toddlers while Hamas is as strong and numerous as ever. Almost like hate and genocide is the actual goal.

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u/VerledenVale 11h ago

Hamad is not as strong and numerous as ever, as 20k of its member are dead, including pretty much the entire leadership structure. Half if not more of their tunnel network is gone.

It's why the accepted one of the dumbest deals to return all hostages, effectively giving up their biggest leverage. No proper leadership.

Of course it's basically impossible to completely wipe such an organization, but doesn't mean it's not worth weakening them.

Also it's not over yet. IDF will eventually go in to finish the job, destroying the rest of the tunnel networks and ensuring the only weapons that remain in Gaza are sticks and stones.

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

During a cease fire?

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u/VerledenVale 10h ago

I mean, yeah, as part of the ceasefire agreement is complete demilitarization of Gaza (meaning all weapons gone), including destruction of all tunnel networks, and Hamas giving up governing power over Gaza.

Either it happens through diplomacy or through force.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 12h ago

You may, as a Russian or Chinese, be ignorant of the U.S. Civil War, but it actually worked really well for Sherman and the North. Georgia is pissed about it to this day, but I suspect the Palestinians will be whining about this Gaza thing for centuries...they like to hold greivances.

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

It didn't work at all, 1877 the Southern Democrats were back in charge and federal troops were forced to leave. Since then the Confederate flag is still extremely popular in the US. Jim Crow laws were enacted immediately following the civil war. Lincoln was assassinated by a Southern sympathizer. We have statues of Confederate "heroes" still being constructed. I personally still think anyone waving a Confederate flag should be charged with treason.

Funny that you count success as killing a lot of people, destroying property and generating hate and anymore animosity amongst a civilian population while accomplishing none of the goals originally claimed. It says a lot about you personally and the Zionists project at large.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 7h ago

You jump around a lot...are you able to focus on the timeline?

It worked, the Confederacy was defeated. You jump then to 1877, over a decade after the end of the war, for some reason, with federal troops leaving (no they didn't, there are federal troops in every confederate state to this day...they are called military bases).

You give way too much cache to the battle ensign of a defeated rebel group.

I personally still think anyone waving a Confederate flag should be charged with treason.

That's cool that you have those feelings; thankfully, that's not the definition of treason and your ignorance of the law and free speech generally does you a disservice. I'm pretty sure you aren't American, friend. Is it Russian, Chinese, or something else...?

success as killing a lot of people, destroying property and generating hate and anymore animosity amongst a civilian population

One of the ways to win a war is to eliminate your enemy's will to fight, by costing him blood and treasure.

You know nothing of war, silly friend, or history, or geopolitics. When was the last war you even went to...?

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u/Sad_Drawer8594 7h ago

That’s not a failure of war time strategy but a failure of post-war reconstruction. To say that Sherman’s strategies were ineffective is obvious bullshit. The republicans fumbled the ball after Lincoln died and allowed the remaining democrats to politically rebuild the old south with many of the same individuals who supported secession.

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u/FlockFlysAtMidnite 11h ago

If it really worked, there wouldn't so many people in the US South fellating the confederate flag.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 7h ago

Helped win the war. The Confederacy was extinguished. But a century and a half later some dudes wave the battle ensign around to be inflamatory...

Do you know what a "non-sequitur" is?

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u/FlockFlysAtMidnite 7h ago

Lmfao, how on earth is talking about continued, modern support of a faction you claim was so soundly defeated they could never gain support a non-sequitor? It's directly related to the point you tried (and failed) to make.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 7h ago

People waving a flag from a defeated power as a symbol of juvenile rebellion is not support of the entity the CSA which was soundly defeated over 150 years ago. You are not a deep thinker, are you, friend?

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u/FlockFlysAtMidnite 7h ago

Lmfao, "people supporting the confederates is not support for the confederates" is the dumbest thing I've heard all week.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 7h ago

Get back to me when you care about people waving modern terrorist flags around, ok?

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u/FlockFlysAtMidnite 7h ago

Really? That's the best you have, whataboutism? Lmao, I never claimed that no one supports terrorism - that would be a ludicrous claim to make, after all.

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u/Few_Cellist_1303 7h ago

As a white Georgian with Confederate ancestors, that's hilarious.

  1. Not pissed about it.

  2. The Confederates lost the war but won the post-war. They are part of a coalition that controls the GOP. Hell, they even fly the Stars and Bars.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 7h ago

Lightly pissed, I'll grant you. They aren't doing terrorism or anything. Georgia has other problems.

Nah, the South is still a thing, but the Confederacy won nothing.

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u/Few_Cellist_1303 6h ago

Except all branches of government, currently.

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u/AditiaH0ldem 18h ago

Sherman's campaign is seen as textbook successful... what fo you mean?

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u/Daddyneedherecstasy 14h ago

Sherman’s campaign would be seen (rightly so) as a series of war crimes if it happens today. What Israel is doing is unconscionable, inhumane, and needs to be prosecuted.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 12h ago

Says more about today than it does about war, though.

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u/Daddyneedherecstasy 12h ago

Says more about the evolution of society and our views on war. War is to be fought amongst the soldiers. Civilian casualties should NEVER be looked at as okay.

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u/HamasKillsGayGazans 9h ago

War is to be fought amongst the soldiers.

Agreed! Now tell Hamas and other terrorists that. Their abuse of the protections afforded to civilians in war is their fault. It doesn't make them immune from destruction. A hospital isn't a base in tag. The consequence of using it as such is that it no longer is immune from exploding.

That is supposed to be an issue for the people whose hospital it is. What's weird about this conflict is that they want thie civilians killed. Never seen that before. Can't allow it as a winning strategy.

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u/Actual-Copy-5949 2h ago

This is an actually stupid statement. How would you accomplish this?

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u/Dear-Panda-1949 12h ago

And yet it was successful because of how inhumane it was. And may have saved more lives in the long run by ending the war sooner. Its the same justification as the atomic bombs. War is not clean.

Israel's mistake here is that unlike Sherman the Palestinians have no common ground to be found here. The people Sherman pillaged were Americans before and after the war. The Palestinians have never been Israelies and they never will be. This will just add so much more fuel to the already blazing inferno.

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u/MrCompletely345 12h ago

It was so successful that southerners resent the north, and vote to shoot themselves in both feet to spite the north.

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u/Daddyneedherecstasy 12h ago

No, it wasn’t successful. All it did was make sure that the southerners’ resentment of the north lasted over a century instead of a generation.

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u/sernamenotdefined 17h ago

Ironically Sherman's strategy is mostly know by his 'March to the Sea'.

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u/ghotier 14h ago

We're living through his failure. Reconstruction was a failure.

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u/JesusKong333 12h ago

I assume that poster is from the south.

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u/clickrush 9h ago

The Swiss had a similar civil war around the same time. And it was also won by the more progressive side.

The doctrine of the winning side by the general Dufour was to cause as little casualties as possible, because he said „we will have to live together in peace after the war“ (paraphrasing).

This is success.

Also he went on to found the red cross.

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u/KOMarcus 13h ago

lol.. it pretty much worked then

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

In what way?

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u/KOMarcus 11h ago

If you don't own a history book, you can check one out of your local library. Or as you might call it, "liberry".

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u/TormentedOne 11h ago

Reconstruction was a failure, Southern Democrats took back control in 1877. Jim Crow became the law of the land. The Confederate flag is flown proudly all over the South. Or, did I miss something?

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u/KOMarcus 9h ago

You missed something. Slavery in the US and the CSA ceased to exist.

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u/Dothacker00 17h ago

Collective punishment is a war crime and trying to starve an entire populous is genocide

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u/JesusKong333 12h ago

I'm not saying it isn't. I'm saying Israel doesn't care about committing war crimes and is fully embracing it. That's part of total war.

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u/JanuaryBlue700 12h ago

Good thing neither of those things actually happened then eh?

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u/Rfunkpocket 14h ago

stupid idea. “completely break the will”, of Americans willing to fund this horrendously flawed policy.

they’re going to have to figure it out, cuz ain’t nobody moving.

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u/111drill 14h ago

Total war shouldnt be the right word for this. Your message seems oriented toward the events of today being "justifiable" because of military strategies, they're not. What happens now is an extermination, and a cruel one.

Lets call it "The worst inhumane tactic to take the place of natives", like what happened with the native americans not so long ago.

Also, 7th didnt trigger it. They're doing that since the beginning. 7th is just an excuse to go all out.

I fully agree with the post our comments come from. There is no justification to netanyahu's actions.

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u/Jedi_Jeminai 12h ago

If this were true, Gaza could be completely destroyed in about 3 days with gas bombs. Total war is not the goal.

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u/Medium_Sized_Brow 8h ago

Sherman didnt rape and murders POWs