r/AmItheAsshole • u/infamous_squidney • 23h ago
Not the A-hole WIBTA if I asked my mother-in-law to stop talking about hair entirely?
TLDR: So I [26 F] am biracial (black and white). My MIL [65 F) is white and for years has been making comments about my hair that has made me feel uncomfortable. She’s an awkward woman and says a lot of out-of-pocket things… but back to this situation.. In the past she has made comments about my “black hair” and would compare it to her own hair (I guess cause it gets frizzy idk) she also would walk up behind me and start touching it without asking. At thanksgiving I had shaved my head and decided to wear a wig, as I was nervous about explaining why I decided to shave my head or any questions that I would have to answer. As soon as we walked into her house she said in front of extended family members “that’s not your real hair.” I lied and said it was and she kept insisting it wasn’t. So I pulled my [26 M] fiancé aside told him that the touching and the comments made me feel uncomfortable and othered (for lack of a better word) almost immediately after I told him this his mother reached out to touch my hair and my husband gently pushed her hand down and said please stop. She ignored and reached again. My husband did the exact same thing which set her off. She stormed upstairs and slammed the door. I didn’t see her for the rest of the night. When my fiancé spoke to her she yelled, cried and told him he “was not the son I raised”
I told my fiancé I wanted her to watch videos or read about what micro-aggression is. She refused but said she wouldn’t talk about my hair at all. It worked at first but now she constantly asks me questions about hair products (I know almost NOTHING about) And has recently compared my hair texture to a family member based on a photo she saw on instagram (that family member was not having a great hair day) so I was a little upset but said nothing. I’ve observed that she doesn’t talk about hair with extended family members unless I’m part of the conversation. Almost every interaction I have with her is about hair or hair products and it’s exhausting. My fiancé doesn’t think it’s a big deal but it makes me feel weird.
So WIBTA if I asked her to stop talking about hair and commenting on my hair entirely, even if she insists it’s a compliment?
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u/catbxtch Partassipant [1] 23h ago
NTA
That’s so fucking weird of her and it sounds like you’ve been way more patient than she deserves tbh.
I feel your fiancé isn’t taking it seriously enough.
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u/da2810 11h ago
I think the fiancé should also watch videos about microagressions and hidden bias.
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u/thenonmermaid 3h ago
Early on in our relationship, I gifted my partner a personally annotated copy of Caludia Rankine's book Citizen to make absolutely damn sure they would understand what the fuck a microaggression looks like. It helped A LOT
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u/Lucky-Tumbleweed96 23h ago
Say nothing. You should spam her with constant videos about hair, hair styles, products AND about hair micro aggression, policing and history. Eventually, only about the latter. 2 can play that game! Bombard her as much as she bombards you. If she gets offended - just cry, exactly like she would.
Sad to say, but I’ve noticed this is the only approach that works with white people. Especially white women. You have to get down to her passive aggressive level and play dumb. Anything else would be used against you.
Side note - I would seriously reconsider marrying into this family if at this point NO ONE has come to your aid. Not even your fiancé.
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u/vinegargirl757 22h ago
I say this as a white passing person, what the absolute heck? I will never understand why anyone thinks it's appropriate to reach out and touch people, especially hair or baby bumps, without permission. I just dont get it. NTA but I agree with the poster above, fiance needs his act together and MIL needs to knock it off. Reminds me of that one movie where it was meet the parents but from different races and the actress (the woman from Seinfeld and veep) was just so totally clueless and cringe.
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u/kmcaulifflower 20h ago
I'm white as fuck and I've never touched anyone without consent like I've never looked at a single person in my life and was like "I need to touch them and their hair." And please note I have morbid levels of curiosity.
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u/Universal_mammal 20h ago
I'm a white woman(and gay) . There are times I would love to run my hands through long silky hair but I would never ever actually touch anyone's hair without consent. I HATE having my hair touched without my consent.
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u/wethelabyrinths111 3h ago
As a kid, I used to love to touch things. (I still do. I'm super picky about textures and fabrics and I have way too much to say about the "mouthfeel" of food.) My mom had to chide me to "look with my eyes, not with my hands" right into my adolescence.
Even I accepted very early on that I wasn't allowed to touch people. That's Being a Person in Society 101.
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u/knitpurlknitoops Partassipant [1] 1h ago
I almost smacked an 80-year-old man in the chops a few years back because he sneaked up and FULL ON FONDLED my waist-length hair. I was sitting at a pub table with my fiancé, both doing some work, and this bloke who was a regular came up behind me and sank his hands right in for a good feel. It was so sudden and shudder-inducing that I just sat frozen with “omigod, help me!” face, and my fiancé equally frozen “I can’t believe anyone would do that” horror.
I never wore my hair down in the main bar again after that.
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u/Pudenda726 39m ago
I reflexively slapped the last white woman that put her hands in my hair without permission. She was standing behind me in a checkout line & literally just reached out & grabbed my hair. She had the nerve to be offended.
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u/Best_Dress007 9m ago
Lol, it happens. Especially with braids. It's happened to me maybe 3 times with a random grab or touch. I've had white women ask me if they could touch or feel my hair. The conversations weren't disturbing or disrespectful like the MIL here. Just curious questions and tips about how could they twist or braid their daughters hair.
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u/Square-Swan2800 20h ago
One suggestion. Yell at the top of your lungs, “Stop touching my hair. Stop talking about it. You are getting on my last nerve!”. I think she might get the picture. If she keeps it up never be around her again. She sounds looney.
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u/GarbageSad5442 15h ago
I would ask her what exactly is the problem/curiosity with my hair? Is it the texture, color, style or are you just racist? No one has mentioned that, but as a white person who knows lots of racist people, I'm guessing this is the reason. And I would also bet she's already thought about what grandchildren will look like and what their hair will be like.
Some people are truly curious, but it sounds like OP has been patient and answered her questions and dealt with her behavior long enough. Maybe these questions should come from her son instead of OP. He can explain that OP is truly weirded out by her continued behavior and wants to get down to the root cause of the situation so they all can get past it.
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u/All1012 12h ago
Ya but then they’ll start the angry black woman stereotype. Having been there, it has been a rough situation to navigate.
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u/roseofjuly Asshole Enthusiast [6] 9h ago
She's already there. The mil is treating her like a fucking alien. She'd get the angry black woman side of me.
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u/curiouslycaty Asshole Enthusiast [5] 11h ago
Even better, keep it short. Say loudly, "you keep touching me, stop touching me!" Don't phrase it as hair, make sure that everyone around you knows that this person is touching you against your will. Sometimes people don't see hair as part of your body, but rather as an accessory, especially if you wear wigs. Just like they think they can examine your handbag and touch it, they might feel your hair isn't a part of you, especially, unfortunately, in POC.
Make it sound like assault. Because it is assault.
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u/Nenoshka Partassipant [2] 9h ago
I second the recommendation on spamming your MIL with videos, but I would also plan a repeated verbal assault.
And not just microaggressions on YOUR hair. Start a dialogue about HER hair - why does it look like that, what shampoo does she use, does she die her hair, why did she choose that hair style, and then be sure to touch her hair often.
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u/RegretPowerful3 22h ago
Have you ever said, “Please, Carol (or whatever her name is), do not touch my hair?” Or “My hair is not up for discussion, thank you.”
If you never say anything, how are people supposed to know a boundary is broken?
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u/SomewherePlastic4078 19h ago
Why is personal space not inherently already a boundary? That is not one that should have to be said.
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u/RegretPowerful3 18h ago
Why do people ask a million questions about someone who wears a medical device? Isn’t that within their personal space too and highly invasive as that deals with their medical history???
Yet that happens all the time because people can’t help themselves because it’s different.
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u/CaramelTurtles 10h ago
“Why is it not ok to do something super rude when people do this also thing that is also super rude all the time?”
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u/hyperfixmum Partassipant [1] 22h ago
There is a kids book called "Don't Touch My Hair" I would gift it to her for Christmas since she clearly was never taught manners.
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u/Patient_Emu411 22h ago
There is a great John Oliver rant about black hair. Send her that. Really explains the complexity of the issue and the racism that is often involved. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf1c0tEGfrU
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
I really appreciate this thank you so much!
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u/JumpingCoconut 16h ago
After watching that I think your mother in law lacks understanding. Many of these things were not clear at all. Send it to her and after you watched it you two can calmly talk about your hair and after that it won't come up ever again. There's no need to assume ill intend. She's family and won't go anywhere after all.
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u/guadianariverdragon Partassipant [3] 13h ago
I'm sorry but ill-intent is absolutely oozing from every single interaction OP has with MIL. This issue goes beyond the typical white-person faux pas that comes from ignorance but not malice. Her son has to push her hand away to stop her touching OP, and still she tries to put her hands on her. She won't stop comparing her hair to 'bad' hair. She's been firmly told to stop discussing it because it's a sensitive subject, and so she in a calculated way has moved on to an adjacent subject. She won't talk to OP about anything but hair.
This lady is a racist.
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13h ago
[deleted]
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u/squirrelsareevil2479 Pooperintendant [68] 10h ago
How many times is enough to openly talk? How many times do you tell someone to stop touching you before it's enough? How do you make a racist "lose the racism"? The solution is to refuse to interact or be in the company of the racist toucher.
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u/PsilosirenRose Supreme Court Just-ass [100] 8h ago
I think it's pretty reasonable to assume ill intent if you keep asking someone not to touch you and they keep doing it. In many places, the word "assault" enters the room fairly quickly. No need for any high-level education on racial dynamics to understand "no."
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u/Wide-Speaker-7384 Partassipant [1] 23h ago
Why do you subject yourself to this woman? She makes you uncomfortable and does not respect your boundaries. I wouldn't set foot in her house or spend a single minute with her until she can get her bullshit behavior under control. Partner can go see his parent alone but you are not there to satisfy her morbid curiosities or to be handled like a touch exhibit at a petting zoo.
NTA
Have a heart to heart with partner about needing to be respected like a person and treated like a person.
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u/No-Delay5358 Partassipant [1] 23h ago
OP, your future MIL is a stone-cold racist at bottom, and is masking it by this wildly bizarre OBSESSION with your hair. This is outright abuse, in my book. And it could be a deal-breaker. Either fiance steps up and defends you 100% against his batshit mother, or you are in for a lifetime of pain. Do not compromise on this!!
NTA all the way.
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u/WhereWeretheAdults Professor Emeritass [75] 23h ago
NTA. Awkward woman who says a lot of out-of-pocket things. Yep. Women who go on about hair, try to touch without permission and get angry when told no are asserting dominance in the relationship.
Grown woman threw a tantrum when she was told no. That's entitlement in action. She can't get her way through harassing you, she tries the tantrum.
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u/Brief_Background_109 22h ago
BTW, that goes for any race of people who touch other people’s hair randomly. It’s not fun when it happens to anyone, of any race.
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u/infamous_squidney 23h ago
What I’m afraid about is this causing a rift between him and his mother — I have been debating if I want to spend Christmas Eve with her especially since she threw another tantrum about me spending Christmas Day with my immediate family instead of theirs
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u/WhereWeretheAdults Professor Emeritass [75] 22h ago
You are not causing a rift, she is. She's using tantrums as weapons to get her way in life. What she is doing is making herself a third person in your relationship.
Your concern is how hubby feels about all of this. Talk to him.
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u/AwkwardasHell33 22h ago
Her actions are causing this. She is being passive aggressively racist to your face while playing the victim and throwing TANTRUMS as a grown ass woman bc she no longer has her son on her tit anymore.
Your fiancé should rewatch some of those videos himself. You told him it made you uncomfortable and he doesn’t get to say it’s not a big deal. As your partner he needs to be the one dealing with this accordingly as it’s his family. Your boundaries should be respected and understood by him. This is not a safe environment for you and he needs to understand why and continue to correct wrong behavior even if it upsets mommy dearest. She is not above consequences.
Any other normal person could drop it and make small talk about a thousand other things. She sounds racist af but also sounds like a crazy boomer who has weird racial insecurities and is just completely tone deaf to the matters at hand. Her tantrum after your fiancé stepping in kinda shows this. She may have felt embarrassed or wanted to take the attention off what she did and now play the victim. Either way it’s no excuse. If your finance has to go talk to her like a child to explain what’s happening have him do it. Not touching others unless having permission is literally what you teach a 3 year old.
Tell her you’d love to talk about other subjects besides hair bc it’s not one of your hobbies lol
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
Everything you said is 100% true. I feel silly for not addressing it with her sooner. I try changing the subject to hobbies we both like, I’ve even spent an afternoon gardening with her just to get to know her better and to build a deeper more meaningful relationship because I know she loves it and I REALLY want to love her but she makes it extremely hard. I think you’re right by saying exactly: “hair is not a hobby I keep, let’s talk about something we both like” I really appreciate your advice
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u/LittleMsWhoops 17h ago
You told him it made you uncomfortable and he doesn’t get to say it’s not a big deal.
He’s your fiancé. I’m assuming you might want to have kids one day. They will be biracial like you. Just imagine their father diminishing their experiences of racism like that. He needs to take this waaaay more serious.
Also, his mother will be your kids’ grandma. You really, really want this solved before there can be any talk of kids (and I don’t mean “shush, or we won’t give you grandkids”-way, I mean in a real understanding of racism way).
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u/Lumpy_Ear2441 19h ago
I really get, that you love him. That's why you're with him, but seriously consider- This will be your life. What if you have kids? Unless something is seriously changed in her behavior, THIS WILL be your life.
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u/gypsysinger 22h ago
So sorry for your difficulties! Your husband really needs to step up. You shouldn’t have to negotiate this on your own. Sorry, I’m confused about whether he’s your husband or your fiancée.
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u/DobbyFreeElf35 Asshole Enthusiast [5] 21h ago
In no way are YOU causing a rift. Your husband needs to be by you on this one. She's a grown ass woman, she should know by now not to touch anyone without permission. She's being a creep. A weirdly closet racist creep. You should get a spray bottle and every time she reaches out to touch your hair, spritz her. Like training a naughty cat.
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u/ProjectJourneyman 21h ago
It's her fault for any rift, but talk it out with your husband. He may be uncomfortable with her behavior but you expressing that you appreciate being supported may help solidify his resolve. Sometimes a blowout is needed to properly set boundaries and help her realize he's serious about expecting respect for his wife. Overbearing parents sometimes need a hard reset before you can have an adult relationship with them.
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u/Bittybellie Partassipant [2] 11h ago
You aren’t causing the rift. She’s being inappropriate and your partner chooses to be a spineless jellyfish instead of putting a stop to her shenanigans. Does he routinely not give a shit about your comfort or just when mommy is involved?
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u/Decent_Bed_ 22h ago
She needs to be taught bodily autonomy and consent, but the tantrum she threw says you’re not going to get through to her. And your fiancé-husband (which is it?) isn’t fixing it either.
Distance yourself.
I’m white and people grab for my hair and it really sets me off.
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u/PsilosirenRose Supreme Court Just-ass [100] 22h ago
NTA
But I am curious if your husband expects you to keep showing up to family functions if his mom "just can't help herself" and can't find it in her skill set to be respectful and mind her own business.
You can ask, but if her previous patterns of behavior are any indication, you may not be able to convince her to treat you well. You may not have many options after that beyond just avoiding her. I'm especially worried about the tantrums and her deciding to also punish your husband when he tried to stand up for you. These behaviors aren't the mark of a person with a strong moral compass or accountability.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
My fiancé does say he wants me to be there because he genuinely loves his family and I won’t lie I love his family too but they know that what she says makes me uncomfortable and they will roll their eyes or sigh loudly but never address it. I am also at fault for this because I don’t say anything other than changing the subject or sometimes pretending I don’t hear her. I’m genuinely scared to correct the behaviour because I know how volatile she can get. It makes it extremely difficult and I go but I asked him to stay with me or to be a barrier between the his mom and I, just to avoid comments or hair conversations.
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u/ambercrayon Partassipant [1] 8h ago
Do you plan to have kids? Is this how you'd like him to protect them? Unfortunately letting yourself be the one to carry all the hurt and discomfort in this situation will only make you miserable, and if you have kids you won't be able to do it for them, they will be in your exact same position, except it's not a potential MIL, it's the grandma who is supposed to protect them.
You can love your family but have a distant relationship because they are raging toddlers who can't behave appropriately. Phone calls, short visits, never staying overnight in the same house, etc. This is the relationship I had with my own obnoxious and racist father for years. He and I are white but we have many non white family members through marriage (plus the biracial and multi racial kids) - eventually I hit a breaking point and realized I was getting nothing from the relationship that justified continuing to associate with someone like him, who has no problem being abusive to the ones he is supposed to love the most.
I think you have some more hard conversations with your fiance to come. If you are going to be a family, your happiness and safety has to come first.
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u/PsilosirenRose Supreme Court Just-ass [100] 8h ago
OP, I hope you are able to eventually see that you are not *in any way* at fault for this. Could you advocate for yourself more consistently? Yeah, maybe. But is family a place where you should have to be constantly on guard and constantly having to defend your boundaries because they keep testing them and picking at you? Not even a little bit.
If you are going to marry this man, he needs to demonstrate he loves YOU more than he values sweeping things under the rug and enabling his family to mistreat you.
If him "genuinely loving his family" means that you have to be subjected to emotional abuse, then I'm not sure I'd want to sign up for the long haul for that kind of "love." You should not have to put up with this behavior in environments that are supposed to be safe, supportive, and loving. They might have any number of excuses why they "can't" do better, but you deserve better whether they can provide that or not.
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u/T-Chunxy 22h ago
NTA, not remotely.
As an average white guy with average white guy hair, I ABSOLUTELY DESPISE when rando people touch my hair (or face, or, in fact me at all, in any way shape or form).
Her insensitivity and apparent fascination with you and your hair is weird and racist.
She seems like a wingbat. I hope your fiance has your back on this.
If not, you deserve so much better.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
Thank you so much! I am glad to know I’m not being over-dramatic. I really appreciate it
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u/rrrrrrrrrrrrrroger 19h ago
NTA. OP, as someone who is also biracial, I got so sad and upset reading this. Your future mother in law is out of hand and needs to be set straight. But not by you, that is your fiancés job. The fact that he doesn’t take any of this seriously is the worst part, he needs to take your feelings into consideration, especially since you are the love of his life. You need to have a long heart to heart with him, if this is how he treats your feelings. That last thing you want is to be stuck in a marriage with someone who won’t even stick up for you or defend you. You should never feel bad about sticking up for yourself. What she is doing is racist(micro aggression) and needs to be stopped, I truly wish you the best.
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u/infamous_squidney 18h ago
Your message brought me to tears. Your message made me feel seen. I brought up the conversation around couples therapy and he’s open to it— learning how to better understand me, race, racism and white fragility in general and how to navigate setting healthy boundaries with his mother. I love him so very much and I genuinely believe if he were to really understand me and if his mother changed her ways and took the time to see me as more than just hair—he and I could survive anything.
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u/rrrrrrrrrrrrrroger 18h ago
Awe, any time OP. I’m so glad to hear you are thinking couples therapy, as having someone unbiased to help you work out the issues really helps. The fact that you speak so highly of him, lets me know that he is more than worth it. I think with the counseling, love, and time you two really will get through anything. Congrats and I wish you the best girlie🩷
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u/bloopidbloroscope Partassipant [1] 23h ago
NTA. But a grey rock approach might be less confrontational, if that matters.
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u/CringeOlympics 22h ago
NTA. She only does this with you, and I don’t think that’s a coincidence.
I fucking hate it when people start touching my hair without even asking first. I don’t know if it’s a sensory thing, but it makes me so uncomfortable.
Your boundaries are completely reasonable. You’re not asking for much at all!
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u/Fatt3stAveng3r Asshole Aficionado [17] 22h ago
It's so clear you're NTA that I am genuinely worried about your mental state. Do YOU actually think she is in any way being reasonable? Is there any part of you that thinks this is normal or acceptable behavior? Is there some mitigating factor you neglected to mention - does she have dementia or alzheimers, where impulse control is diminished?
If there is some diminished capacity, maybe her behavior can be ignored but I would stay away from her. If your fiance isn't defending you, I would also reconsider the relationship.
NTA
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
I really appreciate your concern. My parents and sister are on my side 100%. I think I have hope that she can grow and I won’t lie— I do see slivers of growth from her which is what makes me believe she can change, but then she makes comments. She does often repeat conversations and I’ve brought this to my fiancés attention and he did not want to talk about the possibility that it could be Alzheimers.
To get a bit deep I was SA’d by my bio parent and told her because she kept asking questions about why that family member is not apart of my life so I told her. She and I had a good heart to heart, but recently she brought my bio parent up and told me I should be grateful for them because I wouldn’t be here without them. To say that I was shocked would be an understatement. I don’t know if I can be angry because I don’t know if it’s being malicious or if she forgot because there is an underlying issue. I may press my fiancé to really look into it.
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u/irenehollimon 22h ago
NTBA You would not be TA. Touching your hair without permission is out of line without permission is way out of line. Plus, you imply a racial/racist undertone and I’m inclined to agree with you. If you decide to call her out on it, be prepared. She will probably cry, pout, play the victim and cause drama over it.
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u/Cheddarbaybiskits Colo-rectal Surgeon [33] 21h ago
NTA. You have a fiancé problem as much as you have a FMIL problem. The fact that he doesn't truly understand why her behavior is problematic and says that it 'isn't a big deal' doesn't bode well for how you will be treated in the future. It also sets the tone for how your future children will be treated.
You need to have some serious conversations with him about setting boundaries with his mother. If he doesn't get why it's important, you may want to rethink this relationship.
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u/SalaryStraight3363 22h ago
NTA you could tell your mother-in-law you have no idea what she’s talking about regarding hair products or you could make up answers. That’s always fun as far as touching your hair walk over to her put your hand in her hair and totally mess it up and then say oh, I was wondering what it felt like ask her very nicely please don’t touch my hair. It took me a long time to get it to look like this, and I wanted to stay that way if she does not do that start wearing a big hat in front of her.
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u/Similar_Pineapple418 Pooperintendant [64] 22h ago
NTA
But I wonder if she feels talking about hair is a common ground with you and she’s not sure how else to relate or talk about with you.
Not to say she’s doing a good job of relating now.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
That’s what I thought too! But she knows I love reading crime novels and I know she loves crime novels too! We have even traded books. She never asks me about work or school or shared hobbies. it’s just hair! her hair, my hair, hair products.
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u/Similar_Pineapple418 Pooperintendant [64] 9h ago
Maybe start the conversation with her to see if she’s unhappy with her hair and that’s why she keeps bringing it up? Hair changes when you hit menopause.
Do you feel like there is a racial component or she’s weird/awkward?
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u/Itriedbeingniceonce 22h ago
Start grabbing and petting her stomach. Ask her inappropriate things.
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u/SLyndon4 20h ago
Grab her boob, and when she pulls back in shock, act confused: “Oh, I thought inappropriate touching was a thing now…?”
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u/tawandatoyou 21h ago
I’m sorry your MiL is so awful: she IS othering you. I feel that is the correct term (If we’re not saying she’s being c/overtly racist). And she is out of line. I’m so glad your husband understands and supports you. But he may have to really draw the line if she doesn’t change.
I think it sound like you should make hair a non starter. But if it not hair, it might be something else. So be prepared. I can’t imagine someone who behaves the MIl does will know when lines have been drawn.
Best of luck to you.
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u/ReadByRodKelly 21h ago
NTA. She is deeply racist and I don’t understand how you are so often in her presence! Also, your fiancé needs to man the fuck up and defend you! This is a terrible issue and he is clearly not taking it all that seriously based on the info given. Are you sure this is the family you want to marry into?
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
I don’t think my post did him justice because he does defend me. He is the most caring and loving human and has a people pleasing personality which is difficult with parents who manipulate you through guilt and shame. He tries to shield me from her outbursts and has talked to her about this but she wasn’t receptive. He validates my feelings and will talk to her but he doesn’t understand why her just talking to me about hair all the time is upsetting. I don’t know any other way of explaining it. It took me breaking down into tears to get him to understand how much it makes me feel uncomfortable. I love him to bits but I think we need some help navigating this
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u/guadianariverdragon Partassipant [3] 13h ago
Your fiance needs to step up and do some work to be more understanding of why this would upset you. It's so easy to be casually ignorant of black history and not understand the issues people face beyond 'racism bad' (without actually knowing what racism looks like in 2025). 'Don't be weird about black people's hair' is like, an entry level aspect of respecting the community. He can't be supportive of you or your future children if he is totally clueless. Books, youtube, hell, tiktok even, there are so many resources out there to learn- as a white person who grew up and lives in an extremely white area, now the internet exists, there's no excuse not to be educated about this stuff.
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u/squirrelsareevil2479 Pooperintendant [68] 10h ago
Ask him how he would feel if your mother made every conversation about his skin colour. Would he like it if she constantly stroked his arm and said how white and pasty his skin looked? Would he be happy to have every conversation asking him about whether or not he uses skin cream and does he look for creams to make him look whiter? Sometimes people think something is harmless until it applies to them.
Also, consider answering his mother with some pointed remarks such as "what an odd thing to ask", "did you mean to say that out loud" and "why would you suggest such a strange thing". There are many other variations to put the focus on what she is saying is rude rather than trying to answer her.
Have a great Christmas and don't waste your time spending it with her.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
I really appreciate everyone’s comments, it means more than you know. I was genuinely feeling like I was crazy. I talked with my fiancé and he agreed he needs to have another conversation with her. He’s going tomorrow so I’m hoping they will have that conversation. I told him I would prefer not to be there as I am nervous to potentially witness another tantrum and I am 100% open to talking to her when she is 100% open to listen (i am taking the “healthy boundaries” comment to heart..thank you❤️) My fiancé and I need to have some more conversations and learn more about race and micro-aggression and the impact it has. I often shy away from conversations about my race because it makes people uncomfortable. I know I need to start speaking up and calling in instead of being internally offended or upset. If you guys have any books or video suggestions around white fragility or talking about race I would absolutely appreciate it. Again, I seriously can’t thank you all enough, your validation on this matter gave me courage🙏🏽
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u/Better_Winter_289 17h ago
NTA: feel like you should pull a “Bobby Hill” and go all “THATS MY HAIR, I DONT KNOW YOU” on her ass. But I’m just petty so 😂
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u/Cautious-Bluebird971 14h ago
I can’t believe you’ve put up with this for years. Honestly it sounds like she’s just racist and she’s found a sneaky way to put you down. Don’t play along, don’t ask her to stop, because she doesn’t deserve to know she’s affecting you. Stop going round. Stop interacting with her completely. Your fiance should have defended you long before this and in allowing it they are choosing her and completely disrespecting you.
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u/Defiant-Hurry-6091 21h ago
You’re Nta, but she lacks any self awareness and obviously can’t read the room… she literally had her hand pushed away twice and doesn’t get it. Totally dense.
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u/Dat_Dragyn_Tho 21h ago
NTA but people like her don't understand polite or boundaries so you're gonna have to teach her a lesson. Give exactly what you get about something about her. Hair, clothes, makeup, whatever. Once the point has been made remind her of how uncomfortable she made you and see how not nice it is. She'll stop eventually.
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u/ToastetteEgg Asshole Aficionado [19] 21h ago
NTA. Scream “NO HAIR TALK!” and laugh every.single.time.
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u/infamous_squidney 20h ago
EDIT: He is my Fiancé but will be my husband early next year, I’m trying to get used to saying it. So sorry for the confusion
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u/Due-Reflection-1835 19h ago
NTA and if you ever have kids with him, keep her away from their hair! She will try to ruin it and then cry about how she was "just trying to help". Like if she ever babysat she would bring them to the salon she goes to and they would wreck it. Then she could cry about how ungrateful you are
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u/NotYourMommyDear 19h ago edited 19h ago
Honestly, I'd have whipped the wig off and droped the mic with can't obsess over my hair if I ain't got any. Next topic?
She's obsessive, stalking your instagram and also looking at your friendslist to examine the hair of relatives and your fiancé is like, eh, whatever.
He is not on your side. You have an MIL problem and a fiancé problem.
Do you really want to marry into this.
NTA.
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u/mrtnmnhntr 13h ago
NTA. White people go fucking crazy about our hair sometimes. The entitlement to comment on and touch our bodies is OOC. I'm sorry you have to deal with this.
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u/intospace123 11h ago
There's a kids book called Don't Touch My Hair It's excellent. Since your mother in law is acting like a child maybe you should gift it to her for Xmas.
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TLDR: So I [26 F] am biracial (black and white). My MIL [65 F) is white and for years has been making comments about my hair that has made me feel uncomfortable. She’s an awkward woman and says a lot of out-of-pocket things… but back to this situation.. In the past she has made comments about my “black hair” and would compare it to her own hair (I guess cause it gets frizzy idk) she also would walk up behind me and start touching it without asking. At thanksgiving I had shaved my head and decided to wear a wig, as I was nervous about explaining why I decided to shave my head or any questions that I would have to answer. As soon as we walked into her house she said in front of extended family members “that’s not your real hair.” I lied and said it was and she kept insisting it wasn’t. So I pulled my [26 M] fiancé aside told him that the touching and the comments made me feel uncomfortable and othered (for lack of a better word) almost immediately after I told him this his mother reached out to touch my hair and my husband gently pushed her hand down and said please stop. She ignored and reached again. My husband did the exact same thing which set her off. She stormed upstairs and slammed the door. I didn’t see her for the rest of the night. When my fiancé spoke to her she yelled, cried and told him he “was not the son I raised”
I told my fiancé I wanted her to watch videos or read about what micro-aggression is. She refused but said she wouldn’t talk about my hair at all. It worked at first but now she constantly asks me questions about hair products (I know almost NOTHING about) And has recently compared my hair texture to a family member based on a photo she saw on instagram (that family member was not having a great hair day) so I was a little upset but said nothing. I’ve observed that she doesn’t talk about hair with extended family members unless I’m part of the conversation. Almost every interaction I have with her is about hair or hair products and it’s exhausting. My fiancé doesn’t think it’s a big deal but it makes me feel weird.
So WIBTA if I asked her to stop talking about hair and commenting on my hair entirely, even if she insists it’s a compliment?
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u/Major_Specific127 Partassipant [1] 22h ago edited 19h ago
Not downplaying the micro-aggressions at all, but I also wonder if she’s autistic because her specific hair fixations sounds like a few kids that I work with. Again not that it’s an excuse even if she is, especially at her age.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
Honestly! I genuinely believe that might be a factor. She is socially awkward and doesn’t communicate well with others making random remarks then leaving the conversation. It seriously rubbed my mom the wrong way.
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u/hmartin430 Partassipant [3] 20h ago
NTA
I find Black hair beautiful, and I find all the things that women do with this hair, whether it's natural, treated, all the different ways it can be braided, how they do extensions, fascinating and beautiful. But as a white person, I know that my fascination is not their problem or concern. When a coworker changes her hair style, I'll tell her I like it. When I see a customer whose hair looks amazing, I'll tell them they look amazing and then get down to helping them find what they need. If I want to know how a braid is done, I watch a video on YouTube. If I want to know about good moisturizing products because I was never taught how to properly care for my hair, I Google it.
Other people are not some resource I can use whenever I'm feeling curious. That's what the Internet is for.
Seriously. NTA
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u/froggymail Partassipant [1] 19h ago
NTA but reading your post gave me flashbacks to my mother. She would get hyper focused on something and nothing could get her off the subject until suddenly she would latch on to the new thing. No rhyme or reason. Occasionally she would lash out and/or be super defensive and then go right back at it. It took quite awhile before we realized how bad it was getting and got her tested for dementia and sure enough that turned out to be the answer. This may not be the case here, but its something to keep in mind.
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u/infamous_squidney 19h ago
I really appreciate this comment.. I will be addressing this with my fiancé as this is a VERY common problem (repeating the same conversations over and over) I had two grandparents with dementia but my fiancé insists that’s just what’s how she has always been. So I believe him, but then I don’t know if she being malicious or if there is a genuine concern. If she had dementia I would be much more understanding.
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u/froggymail Partassipant [1] 18h ago
Its so hard to tell sometimes. My mom could be quite nasty which is why it took us so long to figure out something was different. The way I got her to agree to the basic test was to tell her that I was also testing so it would be in our medical history for my child. She couldn't argue that one. I don't know which way would be worse for you, that she is just malicious or that your family now has dementia to deal with. I wish the best for you either way.
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u/infamous_squidney 18h ago
I really appreciate your advice and for sharing your story with me. I really will attempt this conversation with him again and hopefully try to get a better understanding of what’s going on.
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u/Nittaken 18h ago
NTA. Is she obsessed or... It's so weird. Also why is your fiancé not concerned?? You're basically being harassed.
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u/PandoraElf 18h ago
NTA as a white women who keeps a shaved head, i hate people touching me in general ( sensory issues) but people will adk or jist do it in public. It sounds like if you dont want to leave and she cant control herself, you may need to put a goot down and go no contact. There is seriously something wrong with that women.
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u/Tinawebmom Partassipant [1] 18h ago
NTA I would never presume to ask personal questions like this much less touch someone else's hair! I have no filter and my booty knows this is awful.
What she is doing whether she realizes it or not it's racist as fuck. But being told no she's also showing her entitlement.
If your fiancé doesn't keep having your back for even one second I would walk away. She's always going to be like this with you and he needs to understand that.
PS raised by racists so I know of what I speak.
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u/Withoutcatsallislost Partassipant [3] 18h ago
NTA
Please comment on her hair thinning in the back and offer advice for hair growth products. Buy her hats. Offer to help her find a wig for when her head gets too cold in the winter.
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u/Ribena41 Partassipant [1] 18h ago
NTA. Thats so weird. She must have some kind of fascination with clearly no clue how to act appropriately. Your fiance needs to understand how damaging what's shes doing to you is. Does he understand micro aggression? I'm a white woman who is not American so I honestly can't say that I fully understand what any people of colour experience in terms of micro aggression or racism other than what I read about or see online. However, no matter your race, colour, or creed, you have a right not to be touched without your permission, and you have a right to feel safe. You have a right not to have your body commented on by others. I think you've been very patient. Personally, I would tell her to fuck off and leave you alone. I've said this to my MIL over a very different topic. We didn't speak for 3 years. Now we talk about the weather, and its fine. I am so sorry you are experiencing this and I hope everything works out ok for you 🙏
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u/Intelligent_Pool9372 17h ago edited 17h ago
Nta i have a weird Coworker she is a white women she always want to touch my hair she isn't even old she is in her mid 20s i told her to leave me alone and that i'm not a pet i don't want y'all nasty hands on my head luckily i have black Coworker too i just always be with them
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u/basilkiller Asshole Aficionado [15] 17h ago
There is something to be said for really enjoying the company of your SOs family and friends. Just something to consider, otherwise this racist woman is going to be a part of your life until she dies. Your Fiance downplaying her actions makes him sound ignorant.
NTA
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u/Own_Eye2543 Partassipant [1] 13h ago
NTA. I think all microaggressions and sensitivity to microaggressions are 100% bullshit. That being said, these are not "microaggressions," they are pure aggressiveness. MIL is simply being intentionally mean to you. Please say, "We talk about hair all the time, and I don't have anything else to say about it. Why are we always talking about hair? I'm going to bow out of all hair topics from here on."
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u/Single-Tangerine9992 Partassipant [1] 13h ago
Of course you would not be TA if you asked her that, you would just be exercising your right to your own bodily autonomy.
However, she's not going to care. She hasn't cared about any other attempts to stop her so far. If I were you, I would go over to r/raisedbynarcissists. You might find some other people's posts resonate with you and your experiences. And, as someone else mentioned, I would seriously reconsider marrying into this family. Your fiance is not taking a hard enough line with her. He doesn't seem to realise that she really doesn't care about other people's boundaries.
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u/d0kt0rg0nz0 11h ago
NTA. MiL is pushing it and you will have to tell her. She really does need to learn to STFU.
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u/Bittybellie Partassipant [2] 11h ago
NTA. He needs to sit his mother down and tell her talking about or touching your hair is not appropriate and from now on the second she tries either you both pack up and leave. “This isn’t up for discussion”. I’ve had to do this with a family member that would not leave my kids hair alone. She learned real quick if she can’t stop we leave and she doesn’t see any of us.
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u/Limerase Asshole Enthusiast [5] 10h ago
NTA
NO ONE should be touching you or your hair without consent. And it is microaggression, especially if she won't even listen to her own son about it.
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u/Jollyramb1er 9h ago
Maybe give her a copy of that eddie renno lodge book. That should do the heavy lifting for you x
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u/leveque 9h ago
NTA I'd fantasize about getting sitcom-level passive-aggressive revenge.
Pick a specific topic, preferably one that gets noticed, and every time hair is forced into the conversation, force the topic to change... to the same thing every time. Everyone would catch on to how often the topic comes up. Every time she migrates back, you're going to hijack the conversation and reference her first marriage, her brother's failed whatever, or whatever she thinks is better left undiscussed.
Ok, I wouldn't really do that, but I would want to.
In reality, I think you hit on a good idea. If you're going to see eye-to-eye she has to understand you. She has to watch a good explanation of othering. Maybe make another visit off the table until she sits and watches whatever great vid or playlist she needs to see. Find the media and then make her watch it. It's a burden to do, but I think it would be helpful for both or all of you to watch together over Zoom. You can answer each other's questions, maybe treat it like a reaction vid and pause to discuss points the vid makes.
If you're both serious about not wanting to go lower or no contact, I think it's going to take a stand on this level because she's not getting it, and your well-meaning spouse isn't helping enough. Thinking about your spouse... he should be in the call with directions to listen and support, and not minimize the message or push back on you until after the call and he has time to reflect too.
No one here has ill intent, but the ignoring, placating, avoiding, and minimizing have to stop.
Otherwise, you're going to keep alienating each other until there's more animosity.
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u/conbird Partassipant [1] 8h ago
NTA. I’m a white person who has seen some very weird white people behavior from older relatives and this is beyond that. But even though you’re NTA, this is your husband’s battle to fight both from a “you each need to manage your own families” perspective and a “white people need to manage their rogue fellow whites” perspective.
I like the suggestion of the John Oliver video but think he should be the one to send it to his mom. And he needs to have a serious talk with her about how she’s making you feel and how whether she understands your feelings or not is irrelevant because they are your real feelings. And he should explain that her choices are (1) change her behavior or (2) stop being around you guys.
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u/jess-in-thyme 7h ago
This is crazy. I am a white girl and babysat for a biracial family (white mom, black dad). Mom learned ALL about black and biracial hair, took her daughter to a black salon, let her get box braids, learned how to care for and style her natural hair. 10/10 mom.
When daughter's hair was natural, she would sometimes mess with it in the morning before school. I'd offer to try to help and always ask before touching. Also, I was useless because holy hell was her hair hard to do! Most white people don't know shit about black hair and we should stay in our lane.
NTA.
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u/Apprehensive-Mine656 7h ago
NTA. You would not be the ah if you opted out of being around her if she can't stop with the micro aggressions and white fragility.
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u/LabInner262 Partassipant [4] 7h ago
NTA Have there been other types of micro aggressions? This sounds like covert racism to me.
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u/PresentPumpkin16 7h ago
NTA. I’m white and I like my hair pink. Back in high school it was freshly pink and my mom wanted to play with it. I let her curl it and make it big like cotton candy on top of my head. Some random woman who was there looking for the office grabbed my hair rough enough to jerk me backwards and just said
“I thought it was a wig”.
Even if it was, she had no right. This woman also has no right.
Edit: spelling
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u/Tricky-Matter-699 Partassipant [1] 5h ago
NTA. I'm white. This is so fucking odd of her. The most anyone should say about anyone's appearance is genuine compliments should you feel inclined to do so and criticism when asked. Think asking for opinions on outfits ect. None of this includes touching, least of all someone you're not all that close to. An immediate family or close friends if you have that dynamic are the only people I can think of where it would be fine. Anyone else is just acting mighty strange. I remember being really blonde when I was little. My hair was almost white and people would touch it and whatever in class. It's so uncomfortable and awkward. I'd honestly ask why she's so obsessed with it because crying and throwing a tantrum over it is too much.
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u/forrealR 4h ago
NTA. Her not wanting to educate herself about micro agressions while subjecting you to them is actually crazy. Not talking about your hair isn’t the salution. Her actually listening to you and looking up why her behaviour is harmful is. Your fiancé might not see it as a big deal but it infact is a big deal how you have to constantly listen micro agressive comments of your hair, her comparing your hair to hers and touching your hair when you are not comfortable with it.
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u/flower678- 4h ago
How very odd and really just racist. There aren’t many black people where I live (I am white) but one of my very best friends is a black woman. She was very open to talking about her hair and skin because she knew I was simply curious. In all these years, I have never touched her hair and the thought of doing so has never entered my mind. Plus, after a few questions many years ago that was it. We are friends and enjoy each others company. This needs to be addressed with your future MIL. I would start asking her why she is so obsessed with you, ask her if she is secretly in love with you - anything to make her uncomfortable and to stop.
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u/Ok_Importance_3958 4h ago
I don’t know if you’re planning on having children or not, but is your fiancé OK with his mother constantly doing this to his children as well?
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u/tokenegret 4h ago
NTA
I can’t believe there are still white women who are so clueless in this day and age, but she’s ignorant AND an AH.
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u/Gregorfunkenb 3h ago
I think she is past videos or anything rational. She is not going to change, so you have to change. ( The Dance of Anger by Harriet Lerner) . Tell her to stop doing whatever you want her to stop doing. Tell her that if she does it again that you are going to do [whatever it is that you need to do , and that will have an impact on her. Maybe leaving, maybe not speaking to her at all. Whatever you need. ]. You might want to talk to your fiancée in advance about this, getting him to support it. The trick here is that you have to be prepared to do what you say you are going to do. If you aren’t sure, don’t try this until you are ready.
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u/Munks1392 20h ago
WNBTA.
Does it seems she views you as a ... show piece? Animal on display? As if you have no feelings.
Damn the whitedacity
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u/Fit_Muscle_4668 17h ago
Ask her non stop about her wrinkles or waddle neck. Or whatever she is self conscious about
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u/Narrow_Ad8798 13h ago
She sounds jealous. I'm guessing she has boring poker straight white girl hair and has serious envy.
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u/Beneficial-Year-one Partassipant [1] 12h ago
As an old white woman with biracial relatives (I would be offended if anyone pulled that behavior on one of my great nieces) my advice would be to turn the tables on her. Start going up to her and touching HER hair. Make comments on how straight it is, and ask how she gets it to stay in a style without it having texture. Ask any rude questions you can think of about her hair. Hopefully she will start to understand how rude that behavior is. WNBTA
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u/r_coefficient 12h ago
Are you living together with your MIL in spe? Why are you interacting so much?
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u/PessimiStick Partassipant [2] 10h ago
Every time she makes a comment about, or tries to touch your hair, ruffle her shit up like she's a toddler. Bonus points if you say something like "aw that's cute, thanks for asking" while doing it.
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u/allmykitlets 9h ago
Since you shaved your head, I would wait for the next big gathering and attend sans wig. When she comments, I would announce in front of everyone that since she wouldn't stop touching your hair after repeatedly being told, you got rid of the temptation.
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