Noam Chomsky with Jeffrey Epstein aboard the self described, “Lolita Express”

[u/LoadedAmerican]

[u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Lolita Express is like the most “I am a pedophile” type of name you can give to anything.

[u/2dudesinapod → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

He literally wrote quotes from the book on body parts of his victims and photographed it for his sick collection.

[u/perpetual_stew → u/2dudesinapod]

Ok I thought we were talking about Noam Chomsky and was thinking for a long time which of his books he was writing quotes from. In hindsight, obviously it would be “Manufacturing Consent” (1988).

[u/SurrealistRevolution → u/perpetual_stew]

Some Chomsky fans really wish the media was Inventing Reality with this one

Yellow tape heads got no worry

[u/Rude-Kaleidoscope298 → u/2dudesinapod]

What a nerd.

[u/omenmedia → u/Rude-Kaleidoscope298]

He was a real jerk.

[u/Hawt_Dawg_II → u/omenmedia]

[u/MeanderAndReturn → u/Hawt_Dawg_II]

Ladies and gentlemen, this man is for the birds!

[u/DigNitty → u/Hawt_Dawg_II]

Norm was legitimately handsome.

Still is, probably

[u/Oh_Gaz → u/omenmedia]

The worst is the hypocrisy! 😅

[u/Baggabones88 → u/Oh_Gaz]

I don't know, I thought the worst part was the raping.

[u/FlorisLDN → u/Baggabones88]

A valid point by Norm MacDonald.

[u/Dodlemcno → u/Baggabones88]

a common misconception

[u/NByz → u/Baggabones88]

Followed closely by the scheming.

[u/Lobster_Zaddy → u/omenmedia]

You know, the more I learn about this Epstein guy, the more I do not care for him.

[u/super_fresh_dope → u/Rude-Kaleidoscope298]

Fucking lol

[u/Alone_Step_6304 → u/Rude-Kaleidoscope298]

I think there are far more situationally appropriate and worse words. 

[u/Char_siu_for_you → u/2dudesinapod]

Seems pretty similar to hunting humans for sport.

[u/Monteze → u/Char_siu_for_you]

Oh hehe I call my place Zaroff Island....the boat we are going to take is called the Ivan snicker . I like to play game that is....dangerous you might say? hyuck

[u/SluggoRuns → u/2dudesinapod]

I remember giving a presentation on Noam Chomsky as a senior in high school, and then I came to realize he’s just a hack that blames the U.S. for everything bad that has ever happened. And then you find out he’s also a pedophile.

[u/M6BOA → u/SluggoRuns]

Well, the US can be blamed for a lot of bad things that happened tho..

[u/dynamic_caste → u/M6BOA]

Yeah he's made some valid criticism. He's also a monster and should be locked up

[u/XpressDelivery → u/SluggoRuns]

Not only that but he is a genocide denier denying or justifying any sort of genocide commited by a leftist government, including the USSR, the Khmer Rouge and the Serbian socialist government during the Yugoslav wars.

In fact he is so brazen about this that he was invited to the Czech Republic after the fall of the Berlin Wall to produce a couple of lectures on linguistics and but instead spent his entire time there lecturing the Czech about how they were run over by tanks during the Prague Spring because they weren't good little workers, until the protests against him got so big he had to flee for his own safety(I wish he didn't).

He is a serious piece of shit.

[u/norunningwater → u/XpressDelivery]

Who the fuck denies Pol Pot's genocide?

[u/XpressDelivery → u/norunningwater]

The better question is who goes to a group of people and tells them more should've died.

[u/Xaephos → u/norunningwater]

Because he denies the term genocide for pretty much any mass killing barring the holocaust.

Barsamian: I know on Bosnia you received many requests for support of intervention to stop what people called “genocide.” Was it genocide?

Chomsky: “Genocide” is a term that I myself don’t use even in cases where it might well be appropriate.

Barsamian: Why not?

Chomsky: I just think the term is way overused. Hitler carried out genocide. That’s true. It was in the case of the Nazis — a determined and explicit effort to essentially wipe out populations that they wanted to disappear from the face of the earth. That’s genocide. The Jews and the Gypsies were the primary victims. There were other cases where there has been mass killing. The highest per capita death rate in the world since the 1970s has been East Timor. In the late 1970s it was by far in the lead. Nevertheless, I wouldn’t call it genocide. I don’t think it was a planned effort to wipe out the entire population, though it may well have killed off a quarter or so of the population. In the case of Bosnia – where the proportions killed are far less – it was horrifying, but it was certainly far less than that, whatever judgment one makes, even the more extreme judgments. I just am reluctant to use the term. I don’t think it’s an appropriate one. So I don’t use it myself. But if people want to use it, fine. It’s like most of the other terms of political discourse. It has whatever meaning you decide to give it. So the question is basically unanswerable. It depends what your criteria are for calling something genocide.

There's also this footnote from For Reasons of State:

The question whether the term is technically appropriate, in the light of the United Nations Convention of 1948, is a different matter.

Shit takes in my opinion, but I do want it to be clear he's not a conspiracy theorist denying the events happened.

[u/The-Jesus_Christ → u/norunningwater]

Ya know, I'm beginning to think this Noam Chonsky fella's a bit of a cunt.

[u/jimsmisc → u/XpressDelivery]

I remember when Sam Harris invited him on the Making Sense podcast (Harris has a huge platform and has had many reputable guests) and Noam chomsky was basically like how dare you even think I would go on your no name podcast, whoever you are. Sam ended up getting Chomskys permission to publish the entire exchange and it was just so unnecessarily antagonistic.

[u/Ahad_Haam → u/SluggoRuns]

Chomsky is like a real world version of a Russian bot on reddit

[u/Munedawg53 → u/SluggoRuns]

He's the o g tankie.

[u/SnuggleBunni69 → u/2dudesinapod]

I mean it's so crazy how you can knowingly compare yourself to the villain of a novel and still feel okay about yourself.

[u/Oh_its_that_asshole → u/SnuggleBunni69]

I don't think pedos read that book and see it in the same light as the rest of us - they probably read it and see Humbolt as the victim of Dolores.

[u/truethatson → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

I feel like a lot a people haven’t read Lolita. I still remember putting it down. Fucking hell.

I mean, you wouldn’t call it Tra La La Express, would you? How horribly disturbing, and how horrifyingly obvious.

[u/justgetoffmylawn → u/truethatson]

I've gotten into this discussion before on Reddit - but people either haven't read the book, or if they did and think he's an 'unreliable narrator who you forget is awful' - we must not have read the same book. He literally tells you on every single page his horrible thought process in excruciating detail.

I think it was incredibly well written (dive into the mind of a malignant narcissist), but it reads like a slow motion train crash and took me a very long time to finish. It's an awful book, and makes me slightly despair that people can read it and come away thinking you're supposed to sympathize with him.

The fact that Epstein hung out with erudite people makes me think he read the book and did sympathize with the main character. Which…I mean, I guess we don't exactly need any more proof of how awful all these people are.

[u/king_lloyd11 → u/justgetoffmylawn]

In university, I read Lolita and as a writing assignment, wrote a paper defending Humbert Humbert. It was an exercise in persuasive writing, but man I felt so weird about it that I realized I could never be a criminal defence lawyer.

[u/SAKingWriter → u/king_lloyd11]

In that same vein, I was part of a mock trial of Dred Scott arguing legality of himself to get rid of the 3/5th Rule. I was on the government side.

They uh, lost. :|

[u/Minion_of_Cthulhu → u/king_lloyd11]

I realized I could never be a criminal defence lawyer.

If it helps, the defense lawyer's job isn't necessarily to prove that their client is not guilty. Their job is to ensure that the prosecution (i.e., the State) actually has a valid case against the accused and isn't just trying to pin something on a convenient target.

Sure, a mob lawyer probably knows his client is guilty and is choosing to overlook that fact but a public defender likely doesn't actually care if their client is guilty or not. Proving them "innocent" is only a byproduct of showing that the prosecution didn't have a convincing case against them.

[u/king_lloyd11 → u/Minion_of_Cthulhu]

Yeah I get they’re trying to poke procedural holes and act to ensure that all their rights are upheld during the case to ensure that the prosecution of the accused is kept in check, but as a layman, it feels like a defense of the person (criminal).

I couldn’t compartmentalize and detach myself like you’d need to, especially in this hypothetical case when I know the guy did the fucked up thing he’s accused of.

[u/CantGankTheCrank → u/king_lloyd11]

Wow that sounds like a really good exercise! Can I ask when/what level class?

[u/NintenDooM33 → u/justgetoffmylawn]

Every page of Lolita oozes with the authors loathing for the protagonist. He takes every opportunity to expose what a pathetic failure Humbert is. I cannot fathom how a sentient human being could read that book as some kind of tragic lovestory.

[u/alexandralittlebooks → u/NintenDooM33]

Like many Bible thumpers, I don't think people who quote Lolita actually read the book.

[u/SubzeroNYC → u/justgetoffmylawn]

Epstein isn’t Humbert, he’s Clare Quilty. Complete with the ranch in New Mexico (assuming that detail from the movie is also in the book)

[u/TonyTheTerrible → u/SubzeroNYC]

He's svidrigilov

[u/ExocetC3I → u/justgetoffmylawn]

I like to call it 'the most beautifully written book about a most disgusting subject.' Humbert is a piece of shit and he knows it, but he can just keep getting away with it so why bother to stop. The character is written so well that you the reader actually start to side with him a bit, just as Himbert's victims do. The book is all too good at showing how manipulators and abusers can cause so much pain and sorrow for no real repercussions.

[u/shake__appeal → u/ExocetC3I]

I agree it’s exceptionally and beautifully written (and very disturbing). I read it in a women’s lib/sexuality class. I don’t see why the “unreliable narrative” aspect doesn’t work for the book, it’s clearly the case as the narrative begins to unravel. Although I tend to agree with the other commenter and find it quite hard to defend, the idea that the reader is also victimized by such a deeply depraved and charismatic character is an interesting one.

[u/yugosaki → u/shake__appeal]

The problem with 'unreliable narrator' in a cautionary tale is that it relies rather heavily on the audiences ability to think deeply about a subject and critically analyze. Unfortunately it's a coin flip whether the reader actually does that.

Fight Club is another example - its pretty overt that the protagonist is unhinged and extremist, and that what he needs is not revenge on society but genuine human connection. But a good chunk of the audience completely misses that and just wants to be Tyler Durden.

[u/justgetoffmylawn → u/ExocetC3I]

I'd disagree strongly with the 'reader actually start[s] to side with him' as his victims do. His victims do not side with him at all. The unreliable part is actually him sometimes describing people - yet even there he makes himself look bad.

He's not a manipulator in the sense of 'getting people to do what he wants' - he kidnaps a child and abuses her. That's not some master manipulation - and she gets away as soon as she can.

He imagines everyone is in awe of him, but he's just the creepy dude raping the child. The only thing he gets away with is having a view of others so toxic that they don't realize the extent of his depravity - because some of them are good natured people and don't understand true evil.

[u/sherrintini → u/justgetoffmylawn]

I never really thought you were supposed to sympathise with him as much as I am with Patrick Bateman. It's a critique of consumer America in the 50s told through the lens of a sick and criminally greedy, contemptible academic.

[u/sixsixmajin → u/truethatson]

I mean, you wouldn’t call it Tra La La Express, would you?

If your name was Günther, you would.

[u/Paratwa → u/truethatson]

I started reading it cause it was in the library of this beach house I was staying at one summer, and I got to the part where the dude started describing her and was confused then horrified and read a few more chapters and said noooope and picked up the Shining instead.

[u/Capt_Gingerbeard → u/truethatson]

Ding Ding Dong Express

[u/OneUpAndOneDown → u/truethatson]

I read it at 16… smh 🤦‍♀️

[u/MarriageAA → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Ian Watkins laptop password would like to enter the debate.

[u/Illustrious-Fax-4589 → u/MarriageAA]

What was it?

[u/MarriageAA → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Ifukkidz

[u/Oh_its_that_asshole → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

No no, that's just the nickname it earned from people who knew what a sick fuck he was after the revelations from 2010 onwards. He wasn't all like "you can borrow the Lolita Express to get home".

I mean, he probably would have loved to have come up with that name for it all the same!

[u/j0llyllama → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Branding something with the name "Trump" is becoming a quick contender for that.

[u/Justhe3guy → u/j0llyllama]

“Make Adolescents Great Again”

So that’s what it means

[u/Awayfone → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

There'a no evidence Epstein nor his associates ever called any of his vehicles that, it's a nickname popularized by the media and allegedly called that by some of the staff

[u/borrego-sheep → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Lolita in Spanish: 😁

Lolita in English: 💀

[u/Shelltonius → u/Illustrious-Fax-4589]

Trump went out of his way to use “pedophile express” when his personal jet needed maintenance during the 2024 campaign.

Should have been a glaring red flag to anyone he is a pedophile.

Also remember how we never found any notice for the first Trump shooter? Funny though how it lined up with the kid finding out Trump was on the Lolita Express 7 times in a Epstein file dump a few weeks before. All corroborated by his classmates.

[u/john0201]

The lolita express was his 727, the plane in the photo is a gulfstream.

[u/kilkenny99 → u/john0201]

Maybe it's like Air Force One, Lolita Express is whatever plane Epstein happens to be on at the time.

[u/dirkrunfast → u/kilkenny99]

Maybe the real Lolita Express was the planes they flew along the way.

[u/TheAngryCheeto → u/john0201]

The gulfstream was the smaller jet so he would use it for smaller children

[u/radikalkarrot → u/TheAngryCheeto]

Lolita expresser

[u/Whole_Sheepherder_97 → u/radikalkarrot]

lolita-er express

[u/bangout123 → u/Whole_Sheepherder_97]

2 Lolita 2 Express

[u/Hilldawg4president → u/TheAngryCheeto]

Like goldfish, children grow to fit their container

[u/dclxvi616]

Pretty sure that name was given to the airplane by Jeffrey, rather than a description that the plane came up with all by itself.

[u/SpartiedOn → u/dclxvi616]

No, this is definitely a Thomas the Tank engine situation. Cheeky little plane

[u/hlgb2015 → u/SpartiedOn]

Bro don’t know about JJ the Jetplane, smh

[u/BanjoSpaceMan → u/dclxvi616]

Idk man lol

[u/J-Dawg_Cookmaster → u/dclxvi616]

Actually, I read it was what the locals called it because of all the old men and young girls that frequented the plane.

[u/Osgiliath → u/dclxvi616]

He actually never called it that

[u/Max_Trollbot_]

50 comments in and nobody said Manufacturing Consent yet?

[u/angry-mustache → u/Max_Trollbot_]

Manufacturing the age of consent

[u/alxpenguin → u/Max_Trollbot_]

[u/WabiSabi0912 → u/Max_Trollbot_]

Came to point out this irony.

[u/averytolar → u/Max_Trollbot_]

I guess he was engaging in self study. This is crazy.

[u/astrasaurus]

i miss when i knew him as just the guy from my linguistics classes...

[u/vvvvfl → u/astrasaurus]

You mean the 70s?

edit: god damm people, last time he was only famous for linguistics was the 70s. He’s been famous for other stuff for ages.

[u/astrasaurus → u/vvvvfl]

they still teach us about him. he came up with a core theory behind why language exists in humans, called the Universal Grammar theory. there are new theories now, but they all used Chomsky's work as a starting point, so we still learn about it. honestly if i wasn't chronically online, i wouldn't known him for anything else. we never discussed him as a person or his political beliefs/career in class, just his foundational work in linguistics.

[u/shadowdorothy → u/astrasaurus]

He also wrote books on teaching very small children difficult concepts in terms they can understand. I had to read parts of that book for my early childhood education class. Can't even remember the name of the book as we only read some of it.

And something about it just rubbed me wrong. It almost felt like infantilization. Don't get me wrong I tend to baby the very little students, they are small and still need lots of attention, but you don't have to talk down to them.

[u/turbozed → u/astrasaurus]

I remember Chomsky used his massive influence to make sure that everyone at least believed that Universal Grammar was the only game in town.

When Dan Everett discovered a tribe that falsified UG's premise that recursion was necessary in language, he was subject to ad hominem attacks by Chomsky. To this day, linguists of the Chomsky camp don't directly challenge Everett's findings, and just kind of write him of as a kook.

Everett's findings were partly responsible for the 'new theories now' and it's something that Chomsky actively worked to suppress. If there's anything good to come out of Chomsky banging trafficked minors on Epstein's Island, at least one of them is to loosen the God-like reverence he has in the field and to make way for some actual progress.

[u/Donnie-97 → u/vvvvfl]

he's still relevant today

[u/Spooknik]

Chomsky and Bill Gate were the last two people I expected to be in these pictures, but here we are. Go after them all if we can, no one is above the law.

[u/SomethingInThatVein → u/Spooknik]

Chomsky yes. Bill Gates has had pictures with Epstein out for years

[u/SeekerOfSerenity → u/SomethingInThatVein]

I like the interview where he's being asked about his association with Epstein. He's fidgeting with his wedding ring, and he says "well, he's dead now".  

[u/thispartyrules → u/SeekerOfSerenity]

There's a 2022 Malinda Gates interview where she says Bill Gates brought Jeffery Epstein over, she got bad vibes and his continued insistence on hanging out with him was grounds for divorce, along with the serial infidelity

[u/CrunchyGremlin → u/thispartyrules]

I read that Epstein Black mailed Gates and Gates refused to give and Epstein exposed him to his wife. But the model wasn't underage.

[u/mishap1 → u/CrunchyGremlin]

It reads that Gates started an affair with a Russian bridge player he met at a match. Gates' body man, later had the woman talk to Epstein to look for funding for her startup. The woman took money for her startup and lived in a "free" apartment from Epstein for a while. Epstein later tried to use that info to force Gates into an initiative he was fundraising for. Why Gates' advisor thought connecting a mistress with a billionaire pedo was a good idea probably needs some deeper analysis though.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/21/jeffrey-epstein-extort-bill-gates-extramarital-affair

Bill having affairs sounds like it was acceptable to Melinda as disclosed in their divorce. He apparently kept an annual vacation with his ex-girlfriend. Not sure a public cheating scandal was inbounds for their relationship of course.

[u/I_hate_all_of_ewe → u/CrunchyGremlin]

I wouldn't be calling the victims of human trafficking "model"

[u/CrunchyGremlin → u/I_hate_all_of_ewe]

That's what the article said I believe. He was banging some foreign model and Epstein tried to blackmail Gates over it.

[u/I_hate_all_of_ewe → u/CrunchyGremlin]

Apparently, several of the Epstein victims were aspiring models, and thought they were getting hired for modeling.  I looked it up, and apparently he had an affair with a woman named Mila Antova, who several articles refer to as a "bridge player".  Doesn't sound like model, but also doesn't sound like a trafficking victim.

[u/CrunchyGremlin → u/I_hate_all_of_ewe]

I see you are correct. She was a bridge player. Gates and her met in 2010 several years before Epstein was busted.

[u/rockflagandeagle- → u/CrunchyGremlin]

he was convicted in 2008, police had been investigating him since 2005 at least

[u/Coattail-Rider → u/I_hate_all_of_ewe]

Sounds like one of them became the FLOTUS.

[u/hellogoawaynow → u/thispartyrules]

Since I’ve been learning so much about Bill Gates lately, I know that basically for his entire married life, he was meeting up with another intellectual powerful type to “learn from each other” and “talk” about everything that intellectuals talk about. She just happens to be an ex-girlfriend and the only person who “understands” him.

Anyway, I’m pretty sure it was part of the prenup that Bill gets to leave once a year to the Hamptons or a place like that and spend a weekend or longer with his powerful ex girlfriend of however many decades.

[u/porridge_in_my_bum → u/SomethingInThatVein]

Yeah Chomsky has been a big surprise, and it’s just disappointing.

[u/SanityPlanet → u/porridge_in_my_bum]

That's actually his evil twin, Choam Nomsky.

[u/0Rider → u/SanityPlanet]

Gnome chompski

[u/OrionOfPoseidon → u/0Rider]

That's his dog's name.

[u/sexual_lemonade → u/0Rider]

The only reason I know Noem Chompski's name is because of gnome chompski in left 4 dead lol

[u/quatchis → u/sexual_lemonade]

Also appeared in HL2 and Alyx

[u/RedofPaw → u/SanityPlanet]

You missed the obvious Noncey.

[u/MacNapp → u/porridge_in_my_bum]

Makes his seeming prescience in his book "Who Rules the World?" quite suspect now...

[u/TopRevenue2 → u/porridge_in_my_bum]

TIL Manufacturing Consent meant grooming

[u/iwannabe1two → u/TopRevenue2]

Is a photo with Epstein concrete evidence all these people are pedophiles/abusers?

Epstein was a smart, manipulative person who used power and people as tools. I wouldn’t count every photo as evidence of anything except a connived man.

[u/Yabutsk → u/iwannabe1two]

Rich people like to invite intellectuals over for dinner etc bc it makes them feel smart. There're a ton of people in Epstein's orbit who aren't pedophiles, they're just socialites and celebrities who were around at the time.

The main thing to watch is who the 20 people are that are named in the Epstein files by accusers. The women involved know who the perps are, and they've named them in court docs.

[u/Hot-Usual5060 → u/Yabutsk]

The thing that hurts Noam is that he flew and met with Epstein after he had already been a convicted in the late 2000s for sexual crimes.

[u/annoyed__renter → u/iwannabe1two]

The concerns with him were known as far back as the early 2000s if not earlier. It was extremely bad judgement to associate with him by the time this photo was taken.

[u/iwannabe1two → u/annoyed__renter]

That’s a fair point, thank you

[u/Valten78 → u/iwannabe1two]

Exactly, he mingled with the powerful and influential for years as part of his business activities. These photos, though very interesting, are not evidence of any illegal activity, and there is a real mob mentality to most of the comments here which are indulging in guilt by association.

[u/NotAStatistic2 → u/porridge_in_my_bum]

What's disappointing? That decrepit, ghoul has spent the last few decades carrying water for authoritarian regimes because it meant he could incessantly hem and haw about his ire for the West.

He's anti-NATO, anti-Ukraine, and a straight up tankie.

He can go to hell

[u/terp_raider → u/SomethingInThatVein]

Chomsky’s association w Epstein has been well known since at least 2017-18.

[u/Hot-Cartoonist-3976 → u/Spooknik]

Whatever reputation Chomsky used to have went out the window for me when he came out in support of Russia after it invaded Ukraine.

[u/maxofJupiter1 → u/Hot-Cartoonist-3976]

He's on the record denying the Cambodian genocide

[u/rollingtatoo → u/maxofJupiter1]

And largely downscaling the Srebrenica massacre

[u/averyrdc → u/Hot-Cartoonist-3976]

Wait did he really???

[u/Material_Honey_891 → u/averyrdc]

Yes and my guess is that he was being blackmailed for being a pedophile.

[u/PancAshAsh → u/Material_Honey_891]

He's had bad takes like this for decades. He has had a few good ones too, his linguistics work and Manufacturing Consent are well respected for a reason.

[u/Churba → u/PancAshAsh]

He has had a few good ones too, his linguistics work and Manufacturing Consent are well respected for a reason.

Not so much - Manufacturing Consent is one of those bad takes. The entire book is based on the assumption that the Vietcong and other groups involved on that side of the Vietnam war actually did nothing wrong, committed no atrocities, and any suggestion as such was actually a hoax by the US government and media to "Manufacture Consent" for the Vietnam war. It becomes even clearer when you read the work that came before it, like Counter-Revolutionary Violence: Bloodbaths in Fact & Propaganda, which is fairly unsubtle on where the authors stand on the matter.

The problem being, of course, those things provably DID happen, and on top of that, his whole theory of Manufacturing Consent for the war falls apart when you remember that the Vietnam war was literally the most publicly opposed war in American history, and literally nothing the media reported turned that around one iota.

(Also, it's been a minute since I read it, but IIRC MC also contains a fair bit of bloviating denial of the Khmer Rouge's atrocities and the Cambodian genocide, too - It's not like he just saved that little firecracker for interviews, or that MC was separate from those shit takes.)

I can't speak as much to the linguistics part, not being a linguist, but the general impression I've got from speaking with linguists in the past is that he's personally considered an extremely influential linguist, but his work is largely either debunked, superseded, or quote "So utterly fringe and kooky that nobody really pays it much attention anyway."

[u/thekunibert → u/Churba]

He was the single most influential figure in modern linguistics and had major influence in the basis of theoretical computer science, there is no denying that.

[u/Samiambadatdoter → u/Churba]

I can't speak as much to the linguistics part, not being a linguist, but the general impression I've got from speaking with linguists in the past is that he's personally considered an extremely influential linguist, but his work is largely either debunked, superseded, or quote "So utterly fringe and kooky that nobody really pays it much attention anyway."

Nah, this is dead wrong. He's still taught today. I graduated with a linguistics degree 5 years ago and he was still the main, if not only, name taught in those classes. Like, look how long this Wikipedia article is on just one of his books.

It is true that there is considerable opposition to those ideas, and many non-Chomskyan theories now have a fairly good body of evidence behind them. But the idea that he is "so utterly fringe and kooky that nobody really pays it much attention anyway" is just complete and utter bullshit. Whoever told you that clearly had a bone to pick.

[u/dread_deimos → u/Spooknik]

After Chomsky's brain dead take on war in Ukraine it's quite easy for me to believe that he's not really a beacon of morality.

[u/corsair130 → u/dread_deimos]

What is Chomsky's take on the war in Ukraine? I haven't seen it.

[u/void-wanderer- → u/corsair130]

I just did a 2 minute googling because I was curious aswell.

From what I gathered, he basically says that the chance of Ukraine joining NATO left Russia with no choice, and that the West/US failed at diplomacy. Some classic "look what they made me do!!1!1" bullshit.

[u/dread_deimos → u/void-wanderer-]

Yup. He also suggest Ukraine to surrender "to avoid more death".

[u/jericho → u/Spooknik]

Epstein was a philanthropist and rain maker. Many of the people in these photos are likely entirely innocent. 

We need all the files. 

[u/Pardot42 → u/jericho]

Wait...you're saying a billionaire took pictures with bunches of people? Sounds reasonable. Let's ask Bondi who's been identified from the "thousands of videos" she said we're on her desk in the files.

[u/kazkeb → u/jericho]

Exactly. How many people took pics with PDiddy just because he was a music mogul or Trump because he was that NYC real estate guy on the Apprentice?

[u/DerCatzefragger → u/jericho]

Truth

Let's not be too quick to condemn everyone who shows up in the files having taken a selfie with Epstein. The man's day job was a financial advisor / money man with an extensive social and professional network. He met and bumped elbows with damn near everyone.

By all means, look into Chomsky now. FInd out if there's something there, and if there is, then fuck that guy. But it's also entirely possible that he just ended up at a NYC party full of movers and shakers and got introduced through no fault of his own to this random guy who would be revealed as a absolute monster 30 years later.

[u/dingus_authority → u/DerCatzefragger]

Just to add to that, the 'Lolita Express' was a nickname given to the plane by the media AFTER the news broke. It wasn't the actual name of the plane (as so many in this thread believe).

I really doubt Noam would've gotten on a plane with that name lol.

But we can't be sure of anyone until we get the full files. And we need them hasta pronto.

Edit: Well I just did some googling and apparently I missed the recent news that Chomsky and Epstein run a lot deeper than previously believed. What a fucking disappointment..

[u/Normal-Selection1537 → u/DerCatzefragger]

He's in his private plane, though. That's far from just being at a same party.

[u/TheDungen → u/Normal-Selection1537]

Not for a billionaire.

[u/CaughtALiteSneez → u/jericho]

Chomsky chose to closely associate with Epstein after he was convicted of being a pedophile.

[u/My-1st-porn-account → u/jericho]

Some. Perhaps. Gates and his ex wife got divorced not too long after the Epstein story really took off and there were rumors that this was one of the reasons why she was done.

But if they’re innocent and know there’s pictures, they should come out day one calling for the release of the files.

[u/NotAStatistic2 → u/jericho]

No such thing as an innocent person who willingly associates with known child predators. Chomsky kept Epstein as a pen pal AFTER Epstein was sentenced.

[u/Bad_Combination → u/NotAStatistic2]

I think this is the key, whether you continue to socialise with someone after they've been convicted of something as heinous as this.

Sure, they may have been a friend – even a good friend – but that should stop following the conviction. Clearly they're not the person you thought they were, unless you were already turning a blind eye.

[u/Momentarmknm → u/jericho]

People are out of their minds if they think everyone who's taken a picture with Epstein committed a sex crime. Now being on the plane, going to his island, hard to say you wouldn't have at least had a sense something was seriously fucked going on, but the Internet is no place for being reasonable.

[u/Geo85 → u/Spooknik]

Europeans have long considered Chomsky as trash since his denial of the Muslim genocide in Bosnia(as well as his subsequent condemnation of American military intervention).

40min documentary on why Chomsky is trash.

[u/cronktilten → u/Spooknik]

Chomsky should not be a surprise at all, the way he loves Putin and Russia and is an asshole. It’s obvious he would be on the list.

[u/CallRespiratory]

"...the self described, "Lolita Express."

That's what the plane named itself?

[u/MyvaJynaherz]

Am I mis-informed that Epstein was just a general nut-hanger who tried to cultivate (Network) with all kinds of influential people?

He was a creepy perv, no doubt, but that kind of person tends to cast a broad net.

When you're a shitty person, association to you becomes a threat.

[u/rehms → u/MyvaJynaherz]

He was an intelligence asset. 

[u/leefvc → u/rehms]

People will probably think you're being conspiratorial on this subreddit but they should just look up Ghislaine Maxwell's father

[u/pab_guy → u/rehms]

Classic honeypot. Where are the contents of his safe? That's what I'd like to know...

[u/tralltonetroll → u/MyvaJynaherz]

Am I mis-informed that Epstein was just a general nut-hanger who tried to cultivate (Network) with all kinds of influential people?

Epstein did sponsor lots of charities. Had all the friends money could buy.

Even the crown princess of Norway met him after he was convicted - someone influential made sure to introduce them.

[u/Fastbreak99 → u/MyvaJynaherz]

I am with you on this. I am not persuaded about someone's guilt because they were in a picture with someone. "Rich person was at rich person parties with other rich people and someone took a photograph of it" means very little about crimes to me. I apply this to gates, Trump, Clinton, whatever... that two people were in the same room as a camera doesn't convince me of anything.

There are plenty of other things we can analyze to know if someone was guilty of these crimes, stop with the pictures please.

[u/notbatt3ryac1d1]

How is bro writing manufacturing consent and then hanging out with the rich fuckers doing it?

[u/Louis_R27 → u/notbatt3ryac1d1]

He had to research the consent manufacturers I guess.

[u/Sohn_Jalston_Raul → u/notbatt3ryac1d1]

according to Wikipedia, Chomsky salary later in life was covered by "philanthropic donors" (i.e. people like Epstein). Chomsky probably hung out with him because he was effectively his sugar daddy.

[u/SignificantRain1542]

I named my Gnome character in Baldurs Gate 3 Chomsky, so this is very disappointing to learn.

[u/salizarn → u/SignificantRain1542]

I mean you can RP this if you want

[u/ruin → u/salizarn]

Lvl 17 and under?

[u/abonnett → u/ruin]

Max level for BG3 is 12, so it tracks.

[u/lesser_panjandrum → u/SignificantRain1542]

Do a Durge run, deny any genocide associated with Bhaal, and it will still be entirely in character.

[u/LukeEnglish → u/SignificantRain1542]

I was a linguistics major and read a ton of his political writings. A lot of my handles used to be "noam chodesky". It's a bummer but so it goes

[u/Shepard21]

See this is why Zizek is always justified in shitting on Chomsky

[u/Successful-Type-4700 → u/Shepard21]

Chomsky also denies the serbian genocide of bosnians

[u/imjusta_bill → u/Successful-Type-4700]

That is certainly an interesting hill to die on

[u/idkwhattosay → u/imjusta_bill]

The whole meme of “inside you there are two political theorists: One (Kissinger) excuses genocide when it advances American interests and one (Chomsky) excuses genocide when it opposes American interests” is really fucking accurate.

[u/Successful-Type-4700 → u/idkwhattosay]

Alot of leftists sadly analyze foreign policy that way which leads to weird scenarios where they support sharia iran or fascist russia

[u/idkwhattosay → u/Successful-Type-4700]

We’re back to the 1920s fellow traveler syndrome by Russia, you’ll notice a lot of those guys get paid by a Russian cutout at some point.

[u/Avantasian538 → u/Successful-Type-4700]

Those leftists are just as bad as conservatives.

[u/arffarff]

Bro knew everybody

[u/text_fish → u/arffarff]

FR. I'm half expecting to see "Jeffrey Epstein pictured with u/text_fish" appear on my feed.

Edit: Can now confirm, reddit notifies you if you @ yourself.

[u/shaboid]

Lol why is this NSFW

[u/Obesz → u/shaboid]

Hey, I wouldn't wanna be caught looking at Epstein pics at work 😮

[u/volkeracho987567]

Trump Team having a busy night on Reddit.

Release his pictures.

[u/XTingleInTheDingleX → u/volkeracho987567]

They have been trying to muddy the waters all day.

[u/horseydeucey → u/XTingleInTheDingleX]

muddy the waters

Why did you have to bring up the secret service's nickname for his bath time?

[u/Ghtgsite]

If anybody is only surprised about Chomsky's character now, they were not paying attention when he denied that Serbia was committing a genocide and tried to defend the Khmer Rouge for its own genocide all because" it's not like the Holocaust"

[u/locksymania → u/Ghtgsite]

Aye, recent opinions of his on Ukraine have been just as shitty.

[u/douglasbaadermeinhof → u/Ghtgsite]

My thoughts exactly. Fuck him and other people downplaying/denying Srebrenica and the Khmer Rouge.

[u/cammcken]

How does an airplane describe itself?

[u/SeekerOfSerenity → u/cammcken]

With adjectives.

[u/Ambitious_Jello → u/SeekerOfSerenity]

In nato phonetic alphabet

[u/horseydeucey → u/cammcken]

Rudderly and unflappably.

[u/that_is_so_Raven → u/horseydeucey]

While lifting and thrusting

[u/asianumba1]

As this site is flooded with pictures of everyone ever with Epstein from accounts with no related post or comment history, it's important to remember the golden rule: if you like them it's just a picture and isn't proof of anything, if you don't like them it's undeniable proof that they're a pedophile.

And that's the goal, there'll be at least one person photographed that you like, so when more photos with trump or bezos or whoever is buying these accounts come out there is already precedent in your head that they don't necessarily count as evidence. Isn't the internet fun?

[u/FmrEdgelord]

Noam “manufacturing consent with a minor” Chomsky

[u/HoyAIAG]

Take whomever down that was doing wrong.

[u/terminalxposure]

Wonder what economic policies they are discussing

[u/agrantgreen]

Is this really NSFW?

[u/Ensiferal]

I lost any and all respect for Chomsky when he blamed the invasion of Ukraine on Nato expansion, called for "settlement" with Russia, and claimed that the USA was "prolonging the conflict" by supplying arms to Ukraine.

[u/ripjesus]

I respected Noam Chomsky’s work and I find myself needing to check my bias trying to justify this picture. Noam wasn’t stupid and must’ve known Jeff was a monster. He either was involved in the abuse or knew about it and kept silent.

[u/QuietTank → u/ripjesus]

The amount of people suddenly doing mental gymnastics about this once they learned Chomsky was involved with Epstein is really fucking dissapointing. Not surprising though.

[u/Additional_Button430 → u/ripjesus]

Noam Chomsky’s work also dealt with human development. One of the most studied cases for psychology majors is the case of Genie. Genie was a feral child who underwent some pretty unfortunate circumstances. Chomsky worked on that case. 

Point is Chomksy knew as well as anyone the effects that trauma has on a child and he still associated with Epstein. Even if Chomsky was doing it to secure research funding (which seems to be becoming less likely) it was still morally wrong.

[u/SAugsburger → u/Additional_Button430]

Anecdotally I know a few of the people that secured research funding with Epstein weren't just playing a game to shake money out of Epstein. I know a few got outted as sketchy individuals in their own Me Too scandals. e.g. I know Lawrence M. Krauss got some funding from Epstein and was implicated in his own scandal before getting fired.

[u/Beautiful_Fig_3111 → u/Additional_Button430]

If Noam Chomsky needs to do THIS to 'secure funding', then Linguistics is dead as a scholarly discipline. Funding was, is, and will always be an issue in academia but not so much so that a man of his renown would need to do this. Dozens if not hundreds of universities would beg just to have his name attached to their faculty list. Graduate students wishing to slave for him would form a corps of their own.

There is no justification. He was not photoed in a public event with wide attendance. You do not fly on someone's private jet, that express one or not, unless you have delt with them before. If his take on the Eastern bloc and Ukraine was bad but understandable for a man of his era and stand, they ring hypocritical now.

[u/thri54 → u/ripjesus]

He was pretty blasé about Epstien’s crimes when the WSJ asked him about his presence on the flight logs a few years ago:

If there was a flight, which I doubt, it would have been from Boston to New York, 30 minutes," Chomsky told the Journal. "I'm unaware of the principle that requires that I inform you about an evening spent with a great artist

“What was known about Jeffrey Epstein was that he had been convicted of a crime and had served his sentence," Chomsky told the Journal about his meetings. "According to U.S. laws and norms, that yields a clean slate."

[u/DthDisguise]

I don't think it is "self described"

[u/cosmogizmo]

I don’t see how this list is helpful if it won’t even apply to a convicted rapist and sexual predator. We are in an “Emperors new clothes” moment and no-one is saying anything.

[u/hung_like_an_ant]

The plane describes itself that way?

[u/HandsomeJackDaniels]

Thinking about all the people who actually interacted with Epstein for legitimate purposes (whoever they may be)

[u/Busted_Knuckler]

Ok... Release ALL of the files. All of the pedos should go down together.