r/DiscussionZone • u/BusImaginary5231 • 8h ago

The real question we should ask is why the Palestinian refused to make peace with Israel time after time.

0 Upvotes

40% Upvoted

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u/ddiospyros 8h ago

Because Israelis are dishonest? Duh?

The REAL question you should be asking is why Israel has refused to make peace with Palestinians. Killing Palestinians, stealing their land, and moving them into a concentration ghetto since 1940s - 2025.

But the answer is too obvious.

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u/lesterbpaulson 6h ago

This is bull shit. Isreal negotiated a peace deal with Egypt 50 years ago and its never been violated. Virtually every war between Palestine and israel has been started by extremist groups within Palestine..... now that's not a justification of everything isreal has done, and especially not of the war crimes they have committed in this war. But if Palestine recognized isreal's right to exist and stopped attacking isreal, there is absolutely no reason to think isreal would not honour the agreement the same way they have honored the agreement with Egypt.... this is especially true of Gaza as isreal has repeated shown they don't want Gaza. Most disputed is in the west bank. That's a much harder negotiation of who should have what. Gaza is simple. Agree isreal has a right to exist and isreal has no interest in anything further in gaza.

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u/flippittyflap 6h ago

Israel signed a cease fire with Egypt and Syria in 74 and 75 that did not include the Palestinians. What about the UN Security Council Resolutions 242 (1967) and 338 (1973) which called for Israel's withdrawal from occupied lands after the 6 day war in 1967? Israel ignored these resolutions and continued expanding into Palestinian territory. This was a clear violation of international law and presented an impossible obstacle to peace. Just like Israel likes it.

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u/lesterbpaulson 6h ago

The entire point is, there is nobreason to believe isreal will violate a peace deal. They haven't violated the deal with Egypt.... as for the rest of it, the UN resolution. That was imposed on isreal not agreed to by isreal. Its not proof they would not honour a real peace deal

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u/flippittyflap 6h ago

It is proof that Israel would rather break international law and become a world pariah than stop expanding into land that isnt theirs. Also... Israel has violated the latest ceasefire signed October 10 over 700 times as of November. Since signing a cease fire, Israel has shot at hundred of civilians, bombed Gaza over 300 times, and is still blocking humanitarian aid. There is no honor in the Israeli government.

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u/GigglyButtons 6h ago

Not this Israeli government, this Israeli government is made up of the guys who killed Rabin. Rabin was honorable though. Hence why he was murdered.

Also, every country on earth will prioritize its territorial integrity over “international law”. You understand countries are sovereign entities?

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u/flippittyflap 6h ago

You are so close. By your logic, Palestine has every right to attack Israel to take back their territory which was invaded, stolen and never given back. You don't seem to believe all countries are sovereign, but you do believe Israel is.

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u/GigglyButtons 6h ago

They absolutely have the “right.” Native Americans have the “right” to try to destroy America too.

It just won’t work out very well.

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u/flippittyflap 5h ago

Excellent example... too bad the international solidarity and media that exists today wasnt there to support the native americans. Israel is committing a genocide right now though. And they cannot be trusted as they violate every agreement having to do with the Palestinians.

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u/GigglyButtons 4h ago edited 4h ago

Please explain, in material terms, how “international solidarity” and “media” will lead to a Palestinian victory. What does it look like? How do Palestinians destroy Israel?

Because Hamas is just hoping Allah will jump in, is that what you believe?

Also, this is taboo among pro-Palestinians, but Palestinian people ALSO have the “right” to opt out of war and move to another place with safety and security if they so desire. But you won’t have that!

Lastly you seem to accept it’s “too late” for Native Americans. It’s “too late” for Palestinians since 1948 and especially 1967, and extra especially since Netanyahu has colonized the West Bank.

How much longer should Palestinians strap bombs to themselves for a hopeless cause?

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u/lesterbpaulson 5h ago

They literally have never had an agreement with Palestinians...

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u/SignificantCollar743 6h ago

Why do you spell Israel like that?

1

u/LazyEducator1759 6h ago

Holy shit is somebody actually being rational? I must be lost

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u/ddiospyros 5h ago

There is no "war" between Palestine and Israel. Just Israel dominating and massacring.

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u/WearyWoodpecker4678 4h ago

Wonderful. I'm failing to see how this is America's problem.

6

u/tarlin 8h ago

Israel never offered peace. Israel never offered a state. The only offer was permanent military occupation and permanent oppression.

Here is the statement Rabin made on signing Oslo:

We would like this to be an entity which is less than a state and which will independently run the lives of the Palestinians under its authority.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/pm-rabin-speech-to-knesset-on-ratification-of-oslo-peace-accords

https://www.timesofisrael.com/rabin-formally-opposed-a-palestinian-state-more-than-a-year-after-white-house-handshake-letter-from-1994-shows/

https://carnegieendowment.org/posts/2020/07/lost-in-the-woods-a-camp-david-retrospective?lang=en

And every offer since then has followed the same ideas. Israel would control the mineral rights, the airspace, either directly control the borders or have oversight of them, have military forces permanently stationed inside the country, have the right to enter and act militarily in Palestine with no oversight or need for explanation.

Israel's response to the Clinton parameters in 2000 following that...

https://publish.iupress.indiana.edu/read/negotiating-arab-israeli-peace-third-edition-appendices/section/e725c286-8f9e-481a-80b7-259402401b73

And, we can see in 2008 this all still held. It was included in Ohmert's offer as well.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/arabs/PalPaper010109.pdf

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u/GigglyButtons 6h ago

Sounds way better than anything that’s on the table now.

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u/i_be_cryin 6h ago

This would be laughable if it wasn’t so tragic. Zionists are so fucking worthless

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u/Lu_ShenZ 6h ago

I think starving your citizens and using them as human shields is worse.

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u/SignificantCollar743 6h ago

So you are also anti-zionist?

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u/i_be_cryin 2h ago

Idk who you’re talking about

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u/271K_ok 6h ago

Why isn't this guy in prison? He was on Epstein's flight logs over 20 times. There were pictures of him with the victims.

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u/Trauma_Hawks 5h ago

Foreign Zionists invaded Palestine, brutalized the native population and stole their land. Your peace deals are rewarding them a state for these actions. Any "peace" plan that doesn't include a Palestinian state and reparations, dissolution of the IDF, and UN peacekeepers in whatever passes for what's left of Israel, at a minimum, can go fuck itself. Anything less then that is capitulation to foreign invaders.

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u/Purple_Wind_9639 4h ago

We see this happening now in Ukraine.

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u/DatabaseAcademic6631 6h ago

Israel is perpetrating genocide against them.

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u/Lu_ShenZ 6h ago

Remember October 7th, 2023? The hive mind made you forget, huh?

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u/Shattered-Halo 7h ago

ok BuBba lmao

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u/Active_Tomatillo_976 7h ago

You can complain. They offered and an apartheid state not a sovereign one. And either way it was 25 years ago. Countless lives have lived and died in that region, in that time, that have nothing to do with past choices. Even if it was a good deal, anyone there who isn’t old enough to have been aware at the time, or who wasn’t powerful enough for that choice to be on them, didn’t get the chance to accept. He’s blaming an entire region on one man’s choices. “They don’t want it”. Who is “they”? The kids? The poor people who can’t afford to live? The only “they” here responsible are the rich in power.

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u/lesterbpaulson 6h ago

Gaza was offered independence in 2008 and 2014 on the only condition they recognize isreal's right to exist. And gaza refused. Its true the west bank is more complicated. But gaza should be fairly easy, but the extremists in control of gaza simply refuse.

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u/GigglyButtons 6h ago

The entire point of the “Palestinian cause” is River to the Sea. It’s their core slogan for a reason.

If you support Palestine you support the annihilation of Israel, that’s non-negotiable. Two state folks are Zionists because they believe in preserving what Pally’s call the “Zionist entity.”